Without Out-of-Body Travel You'll Reincarnate Forever!

But when you get the whole picture, you really can make a great life for yourself here, fulfilling, content. And know that you can get out at the end. But for that you will need to train. For that, you will need to prepare because the system is not set up to let you out. Okay, so my brain, I'm just going to be honest, wants to reject the hell out of this. There is divinity outside of the matrix structure. You become a different state of being and you can handle Earth plane significantly better. And all depression will be gone because you experience the true essence, the true divinity of your soul outside of the matrix structure. So there are options, there are choices. And I think that that's actually liberating for someone who is listening to because that gives them an opportunity to decide for themselves and not be shepherded like majority of us are here. So this is a small disclaimer again that what you're about to watch could possibly shake you up. Please skip it. If you're not in a good headspace today or in general, just move on. This one's not for you. Look, guys, I'm going to be honest. Like, I see the comments. I know you guys, like, some of you enjoyed Mike, some of you didn't enjoy Mike, some of you really liked Laura. I think that's great. That's what I want to do in this channel is just bring different perspectives. I'm. I'm not sold either way, truthfully. Like, of course, I have my own opinion of where I'm at, but I'm not married to that idea. I want to explore all and any options there are, and that's what we're doing here. So Isabella is in the camp of, you know, soul entrapment, prison, Prison planet. She doesn't like that word, but she does believe that's what's going on here through her own experiences. I read her book after this conversation because I wanted to get a better idea of, like, what she's. Why she thinks this fascinating. Her book is fascinating, I can't lie. And there's some, some interesting things to think about in there. So I will tell you this. I'm going to lean on my own personal experience. That's why I'm doing the work I'm doing to do out of body experiences, so that I can bring that perspective, so that I can explore and, you know, test these things out. Like, is there truly a barrier? Like, that's kind of strange. If there is, can we ever prove that Lucia's real? That would be a game changer, right? Like, there's things that you can start doing once you're able to explore. And I think that's good. I mean, I think that's good to do that. So I'm going to keep doing that, keep following my curiosity. I will tell you what though, if I ever do, after years and years of conversations, my own personal experience fall into this camp and I think that this is a reality. I will say that and I'm just going to be honest. Like this is why I think this and I will do it in a way that I think is different than what's being done right now. Like, I don't like when people talk about this theory and they make fun of other people. I see it in my comments. It's like you guys are all dumb. See you later. Like or, or people in interviews raise or they change their voice like oh, love and light. And they just do things to make the viewer feel like at least me. I feel like you're calling me stupid or something. Right. For believing what I believe. And I don't think that's right. So yeah, if I ever go that route and I think that the way I present it will probably be a little bit different because I still think there's a ton of value in being good and choosing love over anything and you know, having a family and experiencing all the things that you can on this planet. So it's never all doom and gloom. There's always a bright side of things and I want you to remember that. And yeah, I hope you guys enjoy this one. Let me know in the comments what you think. Without further ado, let's get on with you. Okay, good. Okay, so here's what I want to here's what I want to ask you and I guess we'll start with is there a difference between what you think this all is and the prison planet theory? Or is it essentially the same thing? They just call it a prison planet theory or do you call it that as well? I don't like the word prison, but we're not free on this planet. It is. We're within the matrix structure that encompasses Earth plane. All astral dimensions are part of the matrix structure. That includes the afterlife dimension, pre birth dimension, and they are the 12 dimensions that Darius Wright talks about. In my perspective and from my experience of astral projecting and also going out of body in different ways and also remote viewing from outside of the system, my perspective is it's the Matrix and it is within the greater matrix which encompasses other realities, cosmic realities that we know of that all work and interact with Earth plane. So it's like a big pepperoni pizza. Just imagine that, right? A big bubble. And within it, the little pieces of pepperoni are worlds. They all get encompassed under the greater matrix. We are just one of those worlds. Okay, so you mentioned Darius. So I guess my question then is when you, when you hear him talk and he talks about going out of the construction, do you think he's really going out of it or are you saying from your perspective, he's not technically going out of it because he's going on to the physical construct for sure. And I really don't want to comment on someone else's work. I appreciate his work because his work really opened up a lot of minds. I mean, he's got millions of viewers. And the subject that was taboo, the subject of going out of body. Even just a couple of years ago, when I wrote my first book, Live in the Trap, and I mentioned out of body experiences, at that time, it was just me and Preston Dennett, who were kind of sort of on the Internet, mentioning that, but not much. And then since Darius became well known, it grew so much, like exponentially, right? You can see it blew up and everyone is now talking about going out of body. There are different kinds of, of out of body experiences that take us in different realities, into different dimensions, into different realities. And I believe that I have experienced all kinds that I'm aware of and have gained different perspectives about what's going on and the structures that are encompassed within these realities. And because I also taught myself how to astral project originally at 17 years old. And then I was like, whoa, let's explore that. That's fun. And then for about 20 years after 23, 24, I deliberately shut that down because it was interfering with me, with my American Dream experience, you know, So I was like, I'm not having that. I'm having the, you know, corporate career and, you know, the whole thing. And then, and then recovered and started having or deliberately facilitating completely different kind of out of body travel. And in between, I've done all of it. I've done remote viewing. I've done remote viewing while out of body and lucid dreaming. And I was very excited when I listened to your podcast yesterday with Mike, who talks about all of the astral projections and stuff. And so I was like, yeah. Oh, I know this. I know this too. I know this too. I really love that interview. And, and you said you wanted someone else who had similar perspective to his. And you got me. Except I have a bit of a Different take on things. Let's just say a bit of. I believe that I have a broader perspective because I believe that I have traveled in a non physical form completely outside of the matrix structures. All matrix structures, the greater matrix and the construct around Earth too. Okay. When you were, when you were, I guess when you were a kid, did you. Is this a theory you believed in right off the rip? Like I always wonder if it's someone's upbringing, their belief systems that caused them to think this. No. Or no, no, no. Same. Same as everyone else. Right. I was super curious first and I. Oh, this is so liberating. Oh my God. I can do this, this and that, and I can just go anywhere and. And I did a lot of these experiments. As in like you can project yourself and observe your friends right here in the physical reality where you can go to where they're at and see what they're doing. And we were doing that as a group of kids back when I was a teenager for fun. And then I also encountered a shaman and I was talking to him that I was getting interference in these realms. Like spirits would just mess with you. In the lower astral realms, reality is very similar to what we have here. And spirits will just mess with you just, just for fun, right? That there are mazes, there are like astral wars. There are all kinds of like, you know, measuring, you know what, like on in there, like who is stronger, who is big. And the shaman said, well, if you are exploring these realms, you need to learn astral combat. And you can shape shift and be in any shape you want, so choose the shape you want. And then, and then I had aspiring partner and we did that. And then I, then as I progressed, I started going into the higher realms where things don't mess with you, but a certain picture is presented, a certain picture is painted to maintain the system going. And I did not know anything about the system at all till 2016, where I kind of. I don't even remember how. Somewhere online I heard that Matrix is a prison planet. Oh yeah, the alien interview book. And I took a hypnosis session and I wanted to get information on whether it's true or not. And I got a confirmation that it's true. And then, and then I forgot about it. But there were experiences, including two near death experiences that I had. There were experiences that kind of got stored in the back of my mind, right, like in my, in my database. Like this just doesn't quite add up and that just doesn't feel right. And what is going on here. And then in 2023, it was like something just came into my awareness and pushed me to write down, write it all down. And so I wrote a really little book, small book, and put that theory out there. And I thought I was the only one who had that conclusion or came to that conclusion that Earth is not what we are taught to believe. And what's going on in the new age spirituality is not what it's presented to be like or that it supports an agenda of some sort that people are not even aware of it. The whole love and light stuff. And Earth is like a school for spiritual growth and evolution. And I believe that very strongly. I believe that the fifth dimension was like an ascension realm, and new Earth is like all that. And I believed every one of these beliefs because you are the result of your conditioning, right? And then I started questioning it in 2023 when I put out the book. People started reaching out to me coming out of woodwork, saying, oh, my God, have you heard of Robert Monroe? No. Because I wasn't a reader since I started having out of body experiences. And then I learned the next level of out of body experiences. In 2014, I stopped reading altogether because I didn't want to have my perspective affected. I wanted to make sure I wanted to shed all these beliefs and have my own take on things. And so I wasn't reading any books, but people started telling me, oh, David Icke talks about the same thing. And then there's Robert Monroe talks about the same thing. And then this year, I discovered the Nagamati scriptures. 800 pages of confirmation of all of this. That is daily, daily. I read a little passage every day. And it just blow in my mind how much confirmation is in that. And that book was written or these concepts were put in this book centuries and centuries ago. Originally, when these masters or owners or we call them archons now, when they were on Earth and when they were known to people, and people wrote about it and warned others. And all of that is nowhere to be found except in the Nangamati scriptures. So that's the. That's the process, that's the journey. Okay? So my brain, I'm just gonna be honest, wants to reject the hell out of this. Of course, it's like, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. And I will start. I want to poke holes in it. I want to write, but I'm trying to. I'm trying to just search for truth, right? I'm a very curious person. And so I'm like, okay, don't. Because there was times Where I thought out of body was insane. So I have to be like, okay, well, if that's doable, I have to start questioning what I believe. You can see though, how someone would comment. I get a lot of comments now even since on Mike's video they're like, well, that's depressing. And like, I hate, I hate the idea of putting someone who's maybe not doing some well even deeper in depression. I hate that. So it almost makes me like, I don't. Okay, so I gonna, I gotta. Right there interject right now. Because there is divinity outside of the matrix structure. And when you experience that through the out of body experience, when you take your soul, that little tiny fragment that is now here recycled within this reality, when you take that tiny fragment back into the field of what we call source or the divine omnipresence or that essence, the divinity of your soul, the soul recognition level is unparalleled. That cannot be compared to anything modern spirituality offers any Kumbaya or love and light kind of stuff. That is being. We're being fed here. When you experience this one time, it changes your entire human experience. You literally become a different. You become a different state of being and you can handle Earth plane significantly better and all depression will be gone because you experience the true essence, the true divinity of your soul outside of the matrix structure. So this ultimately is the goal of all practices and what I teach and what I practice and the next level of out of body experience because it takes a human and liberates that human from the shackles of the system. So those who say, oh, it's depressing, I'm not going to look at it and I don't want to think about it, I don't want to know about it. They are signing a contract to continue being recycled and running in circles blind. That's depressing from my perspective. But when you find the way out, when you liberate yourself, you experience that divine essence that is indescribable. It's a soul recognition level of returning home before the matrix, before anything was put in place to use humanity as farm animals. So that is actually very empowering. And that is truly something that I hope that more people will get instead of thinking that, oh, if I found out about this, I don't want to think about this because that's depressing. That keeps you in the system. Okay, you mentioned Robert Monroe, so I'm assuming you've read all of his books. No. Oh, okay. No, I only read the Far Journeys and then the Far journeys between chapters 10 and 14, the second book. Well, that's good because that's what I want to talk about. So when he talks about it, he. He talks about meeting bb right? Which is a being. And the being told him. And if I'm butchering this, I'm also summarizing it. But essentially he got like a pamphlet because he met this being in this pamphlet. It's almost like this, this being was on a tour and it explained what, what Earth was, how it got there. And that's where Leash was introduced. Yeah, but he also talks like BB was with another being called AA and if you can get past those names. Yeah, yeah, yeah, they were together. And he talks about looking at Earth with all these rings and like seeing. Yeah. And AA basically got sucked into it. And then it would pop out and they'd be like, hey, like, are you good now? You want to go back? And he'd be like, no, no, no, go. I have to go back in. Because. Yeah, because I got three. And. And then, and then they jump back in and then it would appear again and they'd be like, hey, are you good now? And they're like. He's like, no, this time I was a woman. I never want to be a woman again. And it got farther and farther sucked in. It was probably one of the most interesting ways I've ever heard of this place being described in my. I guess what I'm saying is, is, was Robert Monroe outside of it? Like, how was he there looking? Was he inside still of what you think the astral plane is, or was he viewing it from the outside somehow? You can see, you can view these dimensions from within the Matrix too. So I have no idea where he was. I think that he. It sounds like the way you describe and the way he described in the book. It sounds like he was tapping into this information and connecting with the beings from within the dimensions of the Matrix still. Because yeah, there's another being that if you read on further and even you'll say it talks to him at the end. It says, okay, Robert, I can tell you're upset. It almost was like trying to calm him down because emotionally said after he read that, he got a rote. And a rote for people listening was like, it's basically like a download. Yeah. And it explained the history of Lucian, why it was here. And then this being, he said it didn't. It wasn't a being, but it like talked to him from, I don't know, in his mind. And it was saying like, hey, I could see you're basically depressed. But you need to understand, like if a cow, for example, knew that milk was being used, why would that. Like, it doesn't help the cow. And he was like, I guess. And he kind of was thinking about it. He's like, I guess. And he kind of was okay with it. But didn't that. Don't you just not want to be the cow? Right. Regardless of how it's presented and stuff. The thing is, in the. In the chapter called Shock Treatment, he talks about rays of love Louch that he observed before I read that book. In my book beyond the Trap, I described a very similar visual that I saw when I looked at dimensions of the Matrix. From within the Matrix, I could see the. What would look to me like fiber optic cables. They were transparent, kind of different size. I didn't see them as rays. They looked like pipelines, right? And they were pumping that energy from Earth plane and the lower realms here to support the beautiful heavenly rings of the rest of this structure. And I want to mention something that is very important. Louch has nothing to do with Kundalini Energy. That is something that people confuse a lot because Kundalini energy is your life force and Louch is the energy that is produced when we emote. Regardless of. And according to Robert Monroe, every emotion, every reaction produces loose love, fear, all of them, the entire spectrum. Loneliness being one of the biggest one. And look what's going on on this planet with loneliness. Oh my God, right? Everyone is on into their phone right there and then, seeing nothing, connecting with nothing, right? So according to him, every spectrum of human emotional produces some sort of. Some form of loosh. But that is not Kundalini Energy. Kundalini energy is your hidden gem. When you take steps to activate that, you can use that as your rocket fuel, as a fire to propel yourself outside out of the Matrix system, not through the Matrix system. Because you could not get through these dimensions. You're going to hit the firmament, you're going to hit the dome. You're going to hit the border that separates this or each Matrix from the rest of that space. And there's no way that you're going to get through that. You can only bypass it. And for that I believe, and I believe this based on my own experience, that you need to light up your Kundalini energy, generate the rapid movement of the Kundalini energy that everyone cautions against. Why? Oh my God. Why is this so bad? Why is this so forbidden? Like, don't, no, don't. Don't make Your kundalini energy move rapidly because, oh my God, they're gonna go crazy. You're gonna. You're not gonna go crazy unless you're prone to, you know, but that if directed properly, it can take you out of the top of your head. You don't vibrate slowly like you when you astral project out of your form. You don't need to be in sleep paralysis. You're not laying down, you're actually sitting up and you're sending that fire that like you igniting the rocket from your survival centers into the upper. You're opening up the crown center, the exit point, and you shoot out like a rocket and bypass the entire system in your back home into the divinity of your soul. And it feels you're not there's you. So you can say, I feel that you just become that consciousness again where you came from. The consciousness of everything and nothing at the same time. And only someone who experienced that would get what I'm saying. Because as Tao Te Ching says, the dao that can be described is not the true dao. And he's pointing towards that same concept. So wait, there is a way out. There is a way out. And check this out. Check this out. Right? Let me continue for a moment. The matrix system and what Robert Monroe talks about graduating. Right, Yeah, I was going to ask you that. Okay, right. The graduate in the school of compressed learning to produce what? Love Louch. The highest level of louch. The most pristine, the most distilled, the most. The bestest of everything. Right? That's love loosh. That's what they want. And it says, I'm sorry, And it says right here, it says right here in the Nagamati scriptures, creation of Adam. That's the secret book of John Yaldabaoth, who I just recently saw, by the way, is the head creator. He said, okay, Yaldabaeus said to the authorities with him, come, let's create a human being after the image of God and with the likeness to ourselves so this human may give us light. So all of our stuff about lighter, being lighter, loving all of that. All of that. So Robert Monroe talks about Earth being the school to produce that. Right. But the system allows you to graduate after 2 million years. How do I know this? I know this from the book Autobiography of a Yogi by Yogananda. Yogananda. And he says that if we practice certain practices like Kriya Yoga, we can graduate Earth faster. If we don't practice, it takes a million years of incarnations and for someone. And that's in case the person is living a holistic life in harmony with his environment and the people and nature and stuff. But it also says right there, the chapter 26 of that book, that if you don't live in harmony with your environment, with nature and with other human beings, that time is doubled. Two million years of incarnations of Earth. But there is a way out. So we learn to be, we learn to be producers of higher quality love. Louch to be good people. And then we graduate to the next level of the video game called the Matrix. And we go to a different planet within the astral realm where we're still paying karma, it's still astral karma. And then we cross incarnate between Earth and that. And this I know from chapter 43 of Yogananda's book where his guru Sri Yukteswar resurrects and comes back to tell this story. His guru reached a certain level of would know as enlightenment, higher kind of living. He didn't go out of the matrix system. He just went to the neighboring plan and it was easier and lighter. And then he describes the whole thing that there are infinite amount of realities that are involved in this system, in this process. So there is a slow way to get out, but you take millions of years. I say, why don't we take advantage of this opportunity? Because the system, like you said correctly, you said in one of your interviews, you said, why didn't they make it just like all hell and fire right here, Constant fear, constant stress. So we have the way of living better, of experiencing higher love, divinity within our human experience. It's available and it's called enlightenment or it's called better. So the Matrix system allows us to do that. Let's do it. Let's create beautiful world, beautiful experience for ourselves here while we're here. But at the end of this lifetime, let's get out and not be recycled for another million years or whatever. That's, that's my recent realization that we can totally take advantage of what's available the slow way, but not take the entire path. Do it in this lifetime. Create a beautiful life in this lifetime. Fulfilled, content, loving, unconditional love. Experiencing the state of unconditional love, that's, that's indescribable. Find our own divinity. But in the end, don't graduate to the next pro, to the next astral planet. Just quantum travel out of the system and you're done. Is there anything that would make you change your mind or disprove this theory? I am the work in progress. And I have been learning a lot since I put my first book out in 2023. I've learned a whole lot of information and people are coming from all directions and sending me messages and I've been having experiences and reading these books but so far it's just getting confirmed more and more. I hate to tell you, I would love, I would just love to say, hey, you know what? That's all, that's all nonsense and, and oh, all that beautiful stuff that is we're presented with now in, in new age spirituality. Like all these like big gooey eyed and stuff ideas, all that is the truth. But the Earth being what it is is not. But I'm not seeing, I'm seeing a lot of proof. And even, I mean the Nanga Mighty scriptures. When I discovered Nagamari Scriptures, it literally blew my socks off because every concept that was ever stated in, in support of this theory was written thousands and thousands of years ago in these scriptures that were hidden. So I think that that's a volume of proof. Where can someone find that? The Nagamati scriptures, Anywhere. It's available on Amazon. Here I have the 800 page volume that is an international complete in one volume edition. And it has parts that contain. It has chapters like on. On the origin of the world and the nature of rulers. And it literally talks about creation of Earth and the main archon, his first arrival, that Yaldabaoth figure. And here it is, I can quote right there. Yaldabaoth had great authorities at his disposal. He created beautiful heavens by means of the world as dwelling places for each of his sons because there were seven of them. And in each heaven he created great glories. Seven times glories each son has within his heaven. Thrones, mansions, temples, chariots, virgin spirits and their glories extending up to an invisible realm. As well as armies of divine, lordly, angelic and archangelic powers. Myriads without number. So they might serve. All right, so this is what we're getting. We're getting the information from these beings that interact with humanity so closely. They have been guiding humanity so closely that people channel, that people get tangible support and help from. But they have an agenda. They have the, you know, their purpose is to serve, to serve the system, to serve these beings, to serve these realms. You're talking about like Seth for example, or the Z's by Lee Harris. You're talking about these, these beings that are channeled are technically still all pushing us back into the game. Here's, here's one question I have. No, no no, not pushing. They're keeping us in the game, Keeping us in the game. The whole idea is to make sure that human on the 2 million year journey, right? Or a million year journey or even a shorter journey, but still within the system. Still within the system, you know, so it's not. And, and I would say that a lot of beings that like non terrestrials, that they're part of this, are not even aware of the mind conditioning or the conditioning because they go through the same conditioning within the system, right? Same like you, when you die, you go into the afterlife dimension, you're presented with the life review and you believe that wholeheartedly because everyone else around you believe that wholeheartedly. And whatever the beings that are there telling you, the councils or the angelic ones, or looking like you're someone you, you were worshiping or looking like your dead grandmother, regardless of all that they are telling you certain information, you come, you come back to Earth and you believe that same information. Some people are regressed and remember that and tell that and share that. So everything is just supporting the system. It doesn't mean that we need to freak out about it because we've been in the system from the beginning of time. We are a part of the system. They created us as a part of the system. So no need to freak out. Take advantage of the opportunity that the matrix provide is in creating a better reality for ourselves and experiencing these higher concepts and the state of enlightenment and whatever you want to call it, the unconditional love. But get out, don't be fooled to continue unless you want to continue. I mean there are millions of people who want to continue, so just they can continue. But the ones who want to get out, they can easily, not easily, but with a little effort they can get out of the structure, go back into source. So I really do, I like that you have a, at least there's a positive swing to what you're saying. It's not, it doesn't feel all doom and gloom. Let me ask you this though. Why do they let us talk? Like, why do they let you and I talk, have this conversation, spread this if. Because if I was on the other side and I'm an all powerful and the game plan is to keep us in, why not smite me and not let this YouTube channel like grow or you. We're insignificant. We're insignificant. Look, I recently, I recently had a bone chilling experience where I went into the outermost layer of the astral, which I call the fake void, and I experienced the presence of Yaldabaoth And I didn't know it was Yaldabaoth. It was just like a dracon, like a dragon, blah, blah, blah. And I talked about it in a couple of interviews recently on YouTube. And it was fully aware of me. It was fully aware of me. But the, the attitude, the attitude was just dismissive cold arrogance. I did not make. My presence made no, no more difference than like a presence with fruit fly. And it was very clear that even if entire humanity astral projected and tried to aggravate him, it wasn't going to work at all. We're subject of these beings, so we can do whatever we want. You know, we can do whatever we want here. And this is why I say let's take advantage of what the Matrix allows us to do. And that is use what's called the Law of Attraction. But at the same time, it's starting to look more and more like a YouTube algorithm. So is this the algorithm of a simulation on this planet? There's the question to ponder right there. You know, what you put out, you get back. You watch three videos on a certain subject the night before, the next day you get a hundred of them on your search, right? So use that. It's a part of the system to make a better life for ourselves. Help others, support others. There are true values and true service here to be offered. And we don't need to pull hair because we found out that this is not what we thought it was. But we fully can take advantage of the Matrix and its availability. The Matrix is very flexible. It literally produces what we focus on. What we focus on gets bigger, right? So it literally produces more of the same. And it all ties into our traumas and the generational conditioning on and on and on. But when you get the whole picture, you really can make a great life for yourself here, fulfilling, content, and know that you can get out at the end. But for that you will need to train. For that, you will need to prepare because the system is not set up to let you out. But there is a way, you know, there is a way to make Earth experience as comfortable and pleasant for ourselves as we want it to be. And I think that that's. I'm kind of grateful that they didn't create for us what you said, which you mentioned there, like the constant concept out. Although it's pretty, it's pretty regular, I tell you. If you look at what's going on, right, Every couple of months, every two, three months, as soon as we go like, oh, okay, now it's back to normal, like something else happens. Right? So it's, it's constant harvesting, but we can still, you know, we can still maneuver through that and make a good life for ourselves. That's what I, that's what I strongly believe in. Okay, I'm gonna ask you a question because I think this is, this is the part where most people watching get annoyed. But I'm on team Isabella and team you on team let's annoy people. No, I'm on team make money. I mean, I mean you should be able to do that if you want. But what I was gonna say is when people paint this picture, like, here's where we're at. But there is a solution. There is a way out. Buy my course, Buy my book. I'll teach you how to get out. That annoys the shit out of people. Yeah, and that's, that's look, that's their, that's their conditioning. Remembering that Jesus didn't take any money for teachings because he lived with his mother. And, and by the way, he did work right in the, in the carpenter shop, but he didn't need to pay rent or to, to buy, you know, to pay bills that were all shackled in, within this reality. And even, even I live as much off grid as I can, but I still need to get from one place to the next. So I need a car and, and I still need a roof over my head and, and where to sit and make this interview. So I need the Internet and all that costs money. So I'm not walking on water to, you know, or producing like fish like, like Jesus did out of thin air. Not yet anyway. Just kidding. Hey, you know, we're all in this system and the idea that you cannot charge for your services is outdated. I. That's what I think. You know, if you have something to offer that has value. Unless we have moved into the natural exchange society where we exchange gifts like you have a gift, you share it and in response you receive someone else's gift and money is obsolete. As long as money is there, we're part of the system. So that's, that's where the charging comes from. I agree with you. I think it's important to talk about these questions though, because I see the comments all the time and I see people being upset and I, for one, if this is true, and I think people should all spend their time. I said it in my last video, I'll say it in this one too. If you're being honest and truthful, I do believe that you will either arrive to this conclusion or another, whatever it be, right? But, and if someone, I just don't want them to see, like oh they're, they're charging money, oh there's a course and just discount. That's what I'm trying to do is like hey, hey, hey, relax. Like we all got it, we're all in this world and we gotta do something. I have no, I have no issue with those who get, who get annoyed and discard. Let them continue doing what they're doing and be within their set of beliefs and let them be annoyed. It's their choice, it's their present day belief structure and has nothing to do with what I, I am doing within my belief structure. Those who want to research and find their own solutions, I applaud these people the most because when someone shows up and says show me how you did it and I gonna repeat it step by step and then first of all it doesn't guarantee that they're gonna get to the same outcome. And secondary, that's like spiritual kindergarten, right? But, but if a person is mature enough to do their own research, to do their own discoveries, like that person you interviewed, Mike, he was constantly, and I love what he said, he said that he was constantly on it. He was constantly focused on challenging the firmament of this reality. He was constantly on it. And if it didn't work one way for him to go out of body, he tried another way. And he did that for years. And that is a true pioneer. And that's someone who is going to get somewhere in this reality. But there are a lot of those who want guidance and who want their handheld and who want explanations. And for that there are people like myself who paved the way or blazed the trail and now are sharing what they learned and how they did it. And if a person wants to take the course or read the book, it's up to them entirely. And if they prefer to do it on their own, I applaud them because that's how I did it. I didn't have anyone showing me any of this. I discovered all of this through my own exploration and through that constant like. But this doesn't, this just doesn't quite add up what's going on. And, and, and let's go to the next level. And, and oh, is there the next level? My idea of my spiritual journey was to see how far outside of all systems I can push myself while still holding onto the physical body. You know, that was my personal curiosity and that's what drove me to all these conclusions and discoveries. Okay. So I'm about to start really pursuing this, meaning out of body experiences. Jump back into it. I had my two experiences last year. Had kids, everyone knows my stories, listened. I'm in a zone where I feel like I can start again. So my question is when I do it, because I believe I will be able to do it. What, what is your recommendation? I mean, is it. Can. Can it? Because you said you could be on a lower plane. You could be on a higher. Is there a general. Like, if someone like me were to pop out, is there like A. Hey, 80% of the time you're gonna pop out in this plane. And in that plane you should understand that nothing can hurt you or, I don't know, like, what is your advice for someone like me who's about to pursue this? It depends what outcome you're seeking. If you seek to explore dimensions of the Matrix, the astral realms, lower mid astral, upper astral and the outer layer, then learn how to astral project. And that could be done through slowing your system to the point that you're able to vibrate out. And you talked about that in that interview with Mike in great detail. And I believe that you're also familiar with, with Darius's modality, which is very similar. And this is what I did too, by the way. What Darius talks about makes me so excited because I'm like, I did that too. I did that too. I remember this too. All of these experiments. So if you just want to kind of have fun within the matrix, you can do that and explore the astral. And it will take away your fear of separation from the body, and it would make you feel more comfortable. But pay attention to the beings who pop in and start teaching you without you asking for that at all. You know, that is always. There's always an agenda there somewhere in the background. And just keep what we're talking about now in the background so that you can notice the details. Or if you don't notice the details, you know that you are still exploring dimensions that are part of this system. All right? And you can come out of the body and you can go visit your friends. Like I said, you can be very close to this dimension, although invisible, while your body sleeps, or not sleeps, rests. You can stand in your room, you can look at your body laying there, and then you can go next door. You can go send yourself to your friends somewhere else, like their house or their roof. And so that's very close. You can go through dimensions that are a little bit lighter than Earth plane, but they would still have a lot of what's going on here on Earth too. And then as you continue, you can start going into higher and upper dimensions where it's beautiful, heavenly, breathtaking, just goodness. It truly is beyond description. But. But be aware that the higher you go into the astral realms, the more flexibility and visuals you're going to experience, right? So if you have a preconceived idea of how it's gonna look in the upper astrals, let's say you watched Darius's videos where he shows those bubbles and saying, you see and I have, and you expect to see that. Chances are you're gonna see that because it literally works like the system that scans what's in your mind, in your belief structure and produces exactly that. So my theory is that everyone who truly, wholeheartedly believe that these visuals are what they're going to see, are gonna see the same visuals because they already believe it. If a person doesn't have any idea of how it's supposed to look like, they might end up in a completely blank, empty space. But someone, someone somewhere, somehow either told them or somehow they. They in the back of their mind, they have an idea that heavenly realms, mainly rainbowy and this and that and there's so many pictures all around, right? So chances are you're gonna be seeing what is in the depth of your mind because the system scans. It scans your mind and gives you the visuals. And you can say it's the Astro is very flexible based on the user, based on the observer. Or you can say that it's a simulation that has a technology similar to what we have now advertised that, oh, AI will produce whatever is in your brain, right? So the similarity is incredible. But you can experience, have all these experiences and just have fun with it. It. But then eventually, at some point you're gonna hit the firmament and you will know that. That you will. You can't go past that. And why is that there? Why would that be there if this is like an infinite love in reality, right? Exactly. Like a video game. Like you can go so far in a video game and even get outside of the. The like. Like, I used to love that as a kid I played Halo and I was. I would find these cheat codes that got me outside of the map technically. And I could zoom up super high and I could see the map down here. And it's like, you're not supposed to see that. But I would always hit a wall and it'd be like, it's just the game. The server doesn't go any farther than that. Yes, exactly. Oh my God. And it's ridiculous how similar to that the Matrix structure is. And so we can take the theory now that is very, very popular nowadays and David Icke talks about that too, that it's a simulation. It's a, it's a video game, it's a computer program. It's an advanced AI technology that we're within and it produces the visuals in accordance to our expectations. Same as Chad dbt, by the way. And, and it also, and it also confirms and supports itself for self sustaining reasons. So you keep bringing up that. Yeah, I mean you just use it as a term because it's probably the best movie of all time and it's, I guess it resembles what we're talking about. But you say the Matrix, you keep talking about the Matrix, but in the Matrix there is Agent Smith, right? And, and just like people trying to keep you from going out. And then there's like Trinity and Morpheus, like people trying to wake people up essentially. I'm not, I'm not saying the Matrix based on the movie. I'm saying the Matrix as a construct. Okay. Like the word Matrix meaning the construct. That's why, that's why the movie's named Matrix. Yeah, yeah, exactly that. Yeah. Okay, because, and wait, and, and so in that movie they present an idea that the reality that people are experiencing and Neo is experiencing is a simulation. It's a simulation computer program. Right? So that's what they're calling the Matrix. Behind it is just the code. And good knows, you know, it's this, this boils my brain because I'm not technically savvy. I never played video games, but it just sounds so the law of attraction working exactly like a YouTube or any social media algorithm. How is that where like the chicken of the egg? Or is it just that we are now producing what, what the system is based on to begin with? Oh yeah, no, it's interesting to think about the reason I brought up that was like I was going to a place of like. Okay, well is there, is there a group of like underground group trying to like wake us all up up and say hey look, you're in a game, you need to wake up. Or are we like like how a human would pass an ant farm and be like, like I don't care. I mean they're in there. I don't feel like trying to learn a nance language and convince them that they're in a trap right now. I wonder are we that insignificant where no one cares or is there like this? Because if you watch the Hunger Games, the Matrix, and maybe this is just my brain going crazy, but there's always an underground group trying to warn people like, hey, there's a system, you're in, get out. Or are we just. Or are you that person? Or are people like Jesus that those people? Yeah, you literally read in my mind, you know, like what that guest Mike talked about. He talked about the astrals and you can beat the game while living within the game. I agree with that completely. He explored in his own way and he's bringing that information forward. I'm bringing that information forward. Robert Monroe, David Icke there. Howdy Makovsky. The voices are few and far apart because of the, you know, the propaganda and the conditioning and the agenda and everything. But there are people who are trying to work from within the system to point the way out. And yeah, Jesus. By the way, I don't know enough to make like a scholarly statement here, but my understanding based on the work of Paul Wallace, who is the specialist in this field. Paul Wallace states in his books and in his programs on YouTube that I've watched the Fifth Kind channel and the Paul Wallace Channel. He says that, that Yeshua warned about the handlers and the archons and to not worship them and that his message was the same thing. His message was, you have divinity within you. You are no different than myself. You can achieve that, you can get out and you can experience your own divinity within this lifetime. You're no different than me. You're as much a particle of God or this he said the son of God. But I would say the particle of that oversoul as him or as you, as myself. But the true messages were really altered and reducted and finding the now it's becoming available now you can find authors like Paul Wallace and find information about these things that like different take on what is in the script, in the conventional presentation of the scriptures. But I think that that's the group, you know, that would be that are there non terrestrials who are sending that information and that? I don't know, there are a lot of talk about oh, the aliens are coming and they're going to dismantle the system. I'm not so optimistic about that. Maybe they will dismantle this system that we have figured out. We figured out, oh my God, there's a 12 dimensions, there's the afterlife, there's a pre birth, there's this whole agenda and maybe it's old technology, maybe they're gonna show up and Just replace it with something bulletproof that's like steady. And none of that work for them in between, who knows, you know. So we from within the game, from within the system. Deciphering the system is very challenging, but if you, you are on it, I think you will get some core like foundational level of understanding of what we're dealing with in that, in that book you first brought up. Forgive me, I forget the name already. Which one? That one you held up. That's massive. Oh, the, the Nagamari scriptures. Yes. Yeah. Does that explain how I got here? Like my little piece of divinity broken off from the oneness that is the universe. How did they, did they convince me? Did I get tricked? Did I agree to come in here? They talk about creation of the humans and again, I haven't read 800 pages, are you kidding me? That's gonna take me 10 years. But they talk about creation of the human and the original human was created in a way that we had more divinity within us, meaning more access to what we truly are. And they didn't like it because we were too smart and too connected and could see through their game. And so we were wiped and replaced by the dumbed down kind of variety. And that the soul of the human was brought into humanity through these beings. So somehow they distilled that and brought that into this human body vehicle. That's a very loose interpretation of what I read there. But I tell you this, this I remembered and I don't know now because. Because now as I'm learning more, I'm questioning this too. Was I within the matrix structure? Was it I. Was I on a neighboring planet within the greater matrix and I made the decision probably. But I remember being a part of non terrestrial consciousness and we had kind of like SOS call come in from Earth that they need more souls and why don't we go and help? And I had that feeling like, yeah, I'll go help and then poop. Boop boop. Next thing I knew I was in the human body. And I described that in my first book, Live in the Trap. But there was a point somewhere, somehow same like, same like Robert Monroe talks about that. A.A. right. Who, who decided to jump in out of curiosity for one lifetime and ended up being here for thousands of years? Right. Every new soul that came in after were in some way either tricked or recruited into here. But I think all of that, including Yaldabaeus and including those who run the system, including all kinds of beings, all of that came from the original fabric of source and how that expressed itself into these different life forms, that I cannot explain to you. But in the Nagamati scriptures, these are described as beings, Pistis Sophia and the beings that created the Eldabaoth and then the Aldabaoth created his sons, and then they created humanity. And then, and then there's a whole hierarchy or of different types of life forms or consciousnesses that had names in these texts. Or maybe all of that is a metaphor. So that's my very long and very confused answer to you. I know this. I know that you are in this body as a particle of an oversold. You're not your entire soul. You're not the entirety of what you are in this physical experience. It's just a little part that's having different kinds of experiences in different worlds. And you can withdraw that and return it back to the fabric of your soul. That I know for sure. So that would be my answer. Okay, one of my last questions here for you. When, when I die, you said something I think in another, like, avoid the light or something, right? Or that's what everyone's taught us to like go to the light or something. Maybe it wasn't you or something else I've heard. But what do you do then? Like, look, let's say I'm trained and I like, I, I buy into this theory and I go, okay, and then I'm gonna start my out of body and maybe that confirms it all. And I go, you know what? I think this is real. Is it just remembering that so that when I do pass, it's as simple as saying that like, nope, not going that way, or like how, how, how do you bypass it once you're out of here? Like, what if they just say I don't care if you don't want to go in the light. Normally we just let people, because it's intriguing. But since you're fighting back, I'm just going to pick you up, put you in the light. Correct. And now I'm back in. Yeah. So if you vibrate slowly out of your body at the moment of passing, it's the same as astral projecting. So you will be within the matrix structure. And whether you back away from the light, or you go into the light, or you go into a different color tunnel of light, it's gonna spit you out somewhere within the system that is going to present you with whatever, and then here's your next lifetime. All right, so my theory is that we need to train now to quantum travel out of the structure, teach our non physical form to withdraw in its entirety, in its entirety from this body. Not the astral body, not the sleep body, not the spirit, the entire non physical essence. Withdraw that entire thing, send it out of the top of the head, find the way back into the fabric of your soul and repeat it enough times that you can do exactly the same thing. You can take that route at the moment of passing. And although even if the moment of passing happens instantly, like unexpectedly, an accident or something, right. Everything slows down and you will be fully aware when your body is letting go of you. I promise, I promise. That is a fact. I know that from near death experiences there is a moment when you have an awareness that I'm free. Right? That's the moment to send yourself like a bullet back into the fabric of your soul. Out of the simulation, out of the matrix structure. If you linger around, if you're looking around, if you stand, and if you're looking at your body dying, boop. There's gonna be a white light immediately and a bunch of characters go in here. And if you say no, no, I'm not going, another bunch of characters or another something, something, they will capture you. There is no way to beat the system from within the system. I agree 100 with your guest Mike. He said that? And I was like, yeah, I totally agree with that too. All right. I said one last question, but now I have one last question. I'm sorry, do you think then like this whole idea of, of having guides and choosing your life, do you think that's accurate still? Meaning it's still part of the game, like you think it's this whole thing, but like, can you still, like, could I have chosen my parents and my daughters? And even though I'm doing that, it's like a part of the game, but. And I think I'm doing it to learn because they convinced me that. But it's, it's accurate. Like I get to choose the life I think I want to have. Yeah. Or you get to choose the life that they very lovingly convince you you need to have to have a better learning experience. It just happens to be the one that's available is what you're saying. Like here is an interesting thing that. So these scenarios are orchestrated and then they find the alignment. And if we believe in astrology. I've been wondering about that recently. If we believe in astrology. Right. I talked to someone who translated my books into Italian recently and he was like, my daughter was supposed to be born, I don't know, like a Virgo, but now she's being born a day later, so she's going to be something else. And that changes her whole astrology. And then. And then like, you know, the whole astrological chart which supposedly determines our personality and our personality determines what experiences we have. Our personal reality depends a lot on our personality. And so. And of course, conditioning and parenting and all of that. Right. So. So the daughter held back from coming out, let's just say, because she had to have a specific type of personality. How is that linked to astrology or what she decided or what she was convinced to accept for this lifetime? Right. That's a big question. But we definitely incarnate in soul groups and we do choose our parents. I wrote about that and Leaving the Trap. And by the way, Leaving the Trap is very short. It's only 150 pages, two hours of reading. And it's got. I have that as an audiobook and I have that on Amazon. So it's very easy, short, to the point reading. But that choosing the parents and the fact that we incarnate in soul groups so we continue having shared experiences. I wrote about that book that I know for a fact. And so your children, unless they're newly, Newly recruited souls, which is very possible, newly recruited souls who are watching you and watching your wife going, oh, these kids would be awesome to have as my parents. So I'm going there. And if, you know, if everything aligns, then that happens right there. But as a general rule, we incarnate in soul groups. So chances are that everyone you currently are close with and even everyone you currently know as a broader soul group already had some sort of an experience before together. Fascinating. Okay, well, I said I would have a second person and here we are. Here we are. I really, I. I appreciated that you have a positive spin on it though, that there is a way out. I like that. That. So thank you for sharing that. I think that'll help a lot of people. Yeah. There is a way out. There's a slow way of slowly, slowly getting out of earth plane and into another plane with karma and. But there is a way. The Matrix allows us to make the best of our life here. For whatever reason, we don't care. We're just gonna. We're just gonna kind of tune that out when we're gonna know, know that we want to get out, but make the best of it in this life. And. But don't be naive. Be aware that if you don't want to be recycled for 2 million years, chances are you might want to either do practices that evolve you to the next level of the game or through reincarnations and stuff, or train and get out altogether. So there are options, there are choices. And I think that's. That's actually liberating for someone who is listening because that gives them an opportunity to decide for themselves and not be shepherded like majority of us are here. Okay. Isabella, thank you for being here. I'm glad we made it happen. A little bit of trouble in the beginning, but we made it happen, happen. That's the important part. Yeah. It's a pleasure. It's a pleasure. And thank you for inviting me. I discovered a couple of people I didn't know about through your podcast, so thank you for doing what you're doing and thank you for questioning things. Questioning things. That's the only way to go. Well, I appreciate you. Thank you for that. And I will keep you posted. When this goes live, I'll shoot you an email. Excellent. Sounds good. All right, Isabella, Bye. Cheers.